Application Performance Management (APM) Forum

Executive at a computer software company with 10,001+ employees
Apr 15 2021

Hi,

I'm comparing AppDynamics and Dynatrace for a company with over 5K employees. What are the pros and cons of each pproduct?

Thanks!

Amarnadh Sai , ITIL, Prince2
Engineer at Ooredoo Qatar
Mar 27 2021

Hello All,

I'm still a newbie to monitoring tools like APM. 

Are there any Application Performance Management (APM) certifications for tools like CA APM, AppDynamics, Dynatrace, or any single/general certification?  

Thanks!

Ariel Lindenfeld
Sr. Director of Community
IT Central Station
Mar 22 2021
Let the community know what you think. Share your opinions now!
it_user342780Speed to get data into the platform is one of our most important metrics. We NEED to know what is going on right now, not 3-4minutes ago.
it_user364554Hi, Full disclosure I am the COO at Correlsense. 2 years ago I wrote a post just about that - "Why APM project fails" - I think it can guide you through the process of the most important aspects of APM tools. Take a look - feel free to leave a comment: http://www.correlsense.com/enterprise-apm-projects-fail/ Elad Katav
it_user178302Most vendors have similar transaction monitoring capabilities so I look at the End user experience monitoring features to differentiate. Not only RUM (mobile and web) but also Active Monitoring through synthetics.
Rony_Sklar
IT Central Station
Feb 15 2021

With so many APM tools available, it can be hard for businesses to choose the right one for their needs. 

With this in mind, what is your favorite APM tool that you would happily recommend to others? 

What makes it your tool of choice?

GustavoTorresMy favorite APM tool is Dynatrace, the one agent handling enables fast and agile deployment.
Pradeep SaxenaMy favourite APM tool is Azure Monitoring from this I can check application insights. I can also check when application crashed.
Abbasi PoonawalaMy favourite APM tool is New Relic. Monitoring dashboard shows exact method calls with line numbers, including external dependencies for apps of any size and complexity.
Jol Lee
User at IDCServices.net Inc
Jan 06 2021

I'm researching APM tools. What solutions can perform end-to-end monitoring? I'm looking for a tool that also has the ability to correlate errors. Has anyone tested Tingyun before? 

reviewer1352679My experience having done a similar analysis.  considering the 4 top tools from Gartner magic quadrant which includes Broadcom (CA) APM, New Relic, App Dynamics and Dynatrace. Dynatrace is the tool we selected.  It has the most robust traceability, simplest maintenance/management, most complete support for cloud and on-premise systems and an AI engine delivered with the product.  The AI engine will bring together APM and infra data. New Relic was the closest competitor.  Rich tool set but limited in the AI/correlation capabilities.  Significantly more engineering work to implement and manage the tool.  There is a greater ability to interrogate your data (NRQL) with New Relic but this is manually.  We were looking to maximize the AI capabilities. Broadcom (CA) APM is the tool that we had.  We experienced a lot of promises but little delivery for the platform.  It lacked in all aspects to bring data together. App Dynamics was used at my company but highly complex to implement, maintain and license.  I have the least amount of familiarity with this product as it was managed by a separate team but it took them months to get their containers monitored and they weren't confident in extensibility.
Abbasi PoonawalaNew Relic has everything you need in one place.When you log into your New Relic account, you’ll be guided through a new, unified user experience that makes it easier for you to navigate the platform, find and diagnose problems, provide in-product feedback, and take advantage of new, more powerful features. For existing New Relic users, full platform access enables you to: Access every capability APM, Infrastructure, Browser, Synthetics, Mobile, Logs, and more Collect all of your data Metrics, events, logs, and traces—all in one place Unlock the power of Applied Intelligence Automated anomaly detection and the ability to correlate incidents to reduce noise
SystemsEngineer234z
Principal Enterprise Systems Engineer at a healthcare company with 10,001+ employees
Dec 08 2020

Hi everyone,

I'm looking to purchase an APM solution, and looking for some feedback.

I've shortlisted AppDynamics, New Relic, Dynatrace, Datadog, as well as some others like Big Panda and Corelogic that might be used to bolt on as value add. I have experience with AppDynamics, Datadog and Dynatrace but not New Relic - I'm leaning towards New Relic though.

I want to hear how you did your discovery/research, and what were some deciding factors when you finally picked a solution (E.g.: New Relic has xyz but the fact that Datadog gave us 1 and 2 and sort of has xyz made us go with Datadog).

Some background:

I have background in DevOps, Java and Cloud. Theoretically, my group is DevOps but we're still developing in this area. I'm looking to modernize and automate more, and get rid of all the noise. With whatever solution I end up choosing, I want to improve monitoring and do app tracing for developers. I also need predictive analysis. We're currently doing everything on-prem but we have plans to move to the cloud, so the solution needs to support both on-prem and cloud.

I've put together a survey to help me with researching the tools. I'd really appreciate if you could take a few minutes to fill in the survey to help me out: APM tool survey

Thanks!



reviewer1352679There are many factors and we know little about your requirements (size of org, technology stack, management systems, the scope of implementation). Our goal was to consolidate APM and infra monitoring.  We maintain critical processing on our mainframe so there was a desire to include this in our transaction trace.  Due to a highly mature ELK implementation, we are not trying to incorporate log analytics into solution buy may consider in the future.  We had AppD, Dynatrace, New Relic, and CA Wily all in house at the time of our evaluation.  We eliminated Datadog due to a lack of real user monitoring and AppD based on experience and licensing.  Between Dynatrace and New Relic, Dynatrace won based on the automation, integrated AI, support for "old" techs, and confidence we could eliminate multiple APM and infra monitoring tools.   I would not include products like BigPanda, MoogSoft, in this analysis. They are not monitoring solutions but event correlation solutions.  You will need additional monitoring products to capture data and feed them.  Having said that if you cannot consolidate tools you will likely need to purchase an event solution to make sense of all the alarms. We did evaluate these products but with Dynatrace AI did not feel the business value was there for the investment. Here's a quick pro/con list on Dynatrace & New Relic from our analysis. New Relic Pros: Insights is an awesome product and capability. Lots of capabilities and plugins to extend data collection. The APM dashboard is aesthetically pleasing and intuitive. Good training and documentation are available to support the product. New Relic Cons: Requires lots of manual configurations to implement and support.  Insights product requires an investment of time to achieve value. Licensing is a nightmare as there is virtually no transparency in what you are being charged for. Lack of solution to consolidate alerts across implementation other than significant investment in insights to manually achieve this.   Dynatrace Pros: Very simple to implement and maintain with out of the box automation which supports modern (cloud/Kubernetes) and "old" (mainframe). In-app chat is helpful.  High integration of infra and APM data for full-stack observability and engineering.  Topology and trace discovery is more reliable than other products or our CMDB.  Synthetics are easy to set up for any user. AI-assisted problem analysis on the trace discovery streamlines troubleshooting.  AI includes "events" in an analysis like VMotion, deployment events. Have not done yet but looking to leverage monitoring as code for a fully integrated and automated delivery pipeline. See keptn.sh open source project. Dynatrace Cons: User SQL lacks some functions of NRQL for user analysis.  Host, process, and service data is not available to query within the product.  Alarm processing lacks some granular controls. The Plug-in library is less robust. Good luck with your decision!
Tjeerd SaijoenThe key is to have a holistic view over the complete infrastructure, the ones you have listed are great for APM if you need to monitor applications end to end. I have tested them all and have not found one capable to give me solutions they all report you have a problem but you need to figure out what the problems is. So we have decided to develop our own AI and it is not only monitoring OSI layer 1 -3 but layer 1-8 as well it give you a solution what has been wrong based on delays in transactions combined with security. We have deployed this now across healthcare in the USA as well Airports but it is working on every industry and working in a SaaS solution. But if I have a chose between the tools you mentioned, Dynatrace is the best choose it is easy to install and has a great interface. Also it has almost no configuration.
Adrian AntonypillaiWe are currently going through a paper-based analysis to select an Enterprise APM solution. Our Contenders are 1. Dynatrace 2. Cisco(AppDynamics) 3. Broadcom DX-APM Shortlisted based on existing relationships with other products and services they provide. We discounted New Relic- despite their growing capability - as they are yet to enter the enterprise APM solution scene. With regards to your response "We eliminated Datadog due to a lack of real user monitoring and AppD based on experience and licensing .." : Will you be willing to expand on Appd - what was your experience and issues w.r.t licensing. These could help us with our evaluation. Much appreciated. Regards Adrian
Rony_Sklar
IT Central Station

How does it differ from ITSM? Which products would you recommend to make up a fully defined ITOM suite?

DonaldBakelsIT operations management (ITOM) software is intended to represent all the tools needed to manage the provisioning, capacity, performance and availability of computing, networking and application resources — as well as the overall quality, efficiency and experience of their delivery, I would recommend at least the following products Application & underlying infrastructure monitoring, ITSM Servicedesk & Security management software.
Rony_Sklar
IT Central Station

How is synthetic monitoring used in Application Performance Management (APM)? 

Michael SydorSynthetics for production, are best used when there is little or no traffic to help confirm that your external access points are functioning.  They also can be used to stress test components or systems - simulating traffic to test firewall capacity or message queue behavior  and many other cases.  You can also use synthetics to do availability testing during your operational day - again usually directed at your external points.  Technology for cloud monitoring is generally synthetics.  And the ever-popular speedtest.net is effectively doing synthetics to assess internet speed.  The challenge with synthetics is maintaining those transactions.  They need to be updated every time you make changes in you code base (that affects the transactions) and to cover all of the scenarios you care about.  And also the HW requirements to support the generation and analysis of what can quickly become thousands of different transactions.  Often this results in synthetics being used every 30 minutes (or longer) - which, of course, defeats the usefulness as an availability monitor. Real User monitoring is just that - real transactions, not simulated.  You use the transaction volume to infer availability of the various endpoints, and baselines for transaction type and volume to assess the availability.  This eliminates the extra step of keeping the synthetics up-to date and trying to live with the intervals at which you have visibility into actual traffic conditions.  But it will take extra work to decide which transactions are significant and to establish the baseline behaviors, especially when you have seasonality or Time-of-Day considerations that vary greatly. However, I'm seeing that the best measure of transaction performance is to add user sentiment to your APM.  Don't guess at what the transaction volume means - simply ask the user if things are going well, or not!  This helps you narrow down what activities are significant, and thus what KPIs need to be in your baseline. A good APM Practice will use both synthetics and real-user monitoring - where appropriate!  You do not choose one over the other.  You have to be mindful of where each tool has its strengths, what visibility they offer and the process that they need for effective use.
Sunder RajagopalanSynthetic monitoring helps simulate traffic from various geographic locations 24/7 at some regular frequency, say 5 minutes to make sure your services are available and performing as expected. In addition, running Synthetic monitoring along with alerts on some of your critical services that are dependent on other external connections like Payment Gateways, etc. will help you catch any issues with external connections proactively and address them before your users experience any issue with your services.
NetworkOb0a3I think different shops may use the term differently. In regards to an industry standard the other replies may be more appropriate.  I can tell you that where I work we refer to SEUM (Synthetic End User Monitoring) UX and Synthetic (both user experience monitors)  monitoring as simulating actual human activities and setting various types of validations. These validations may be load times for images, text, pages, or validating an expected action based on the steps completed by the monitor. We target all aspects of infrastructure / platform for standard monitoring and then for any user facing service we try to place at least one Synthetic / UX monitor on top of the process. I often find the most value from our Synthetics comes in the form of historical trending. Great examples of NOC wins have been patch X was applied and we noticed a consistent 3 second additional time required to complete UX monitor step Y. Another value from Synthetics is quickly assessing actual user impact. More mature orgs may have this all mapped out but I have found that many NOCs will see alarms on several services but not be able to determine what this means to an actual user community until feedback comes in via tickets or user reported issues. Seeing the standard alarms tells me what is broken, then seeing which steps are failing in the synthetics tells me what this means to our users.  I think that one of the great benefits to an open forum like this is getting to consider how each org does things. There are no wrong answers, just some info applies better for what you may be asking. 
Menachem D Pritzker
Director of Growth
IT Central Station

Below are the rankings. What do you think?

Gartner reports these four solutions as Leaders:

  • Cisco (AppDynamics)
  • Dynatrace
  • New Relic
  • Broadcom

These are the Visionaries:

  • Splunk (SignalFx)
  • Datadog

Only one Challenger:

  • Microsoft

Eight Niche Players:

  • Riverbed (Aternity)
  • IBM
  • Instana
  • Oracle
  • SolarWinds
  • Tingyun
  • ManageEngine
  • Micro Focus

Thoughts?

Tjeerd SaijoenIf you ask what I think of the 2020 Gartner Magic Quadrant, after more than 30 years of experience in mainframes, distributed environments, I would say look to a piece of software and not how to resolve performance problems in a multi-cloud environment. To give you a few examples, if you have a performance problem and you have for example an APM tool, but the problem is because of a wrong setting in a database parameter, you don't find it with any of these tools. We had situations where they were running problems for over a year and all the vendors were not capable of finding a solution. You need a total overview of an environment including virtualization, infra, databases, web servers, load balancers, etc. otherwise an APM tool will help if it is an APM problem, but if it is a configuration problem you will not find it. Same with infrastructure, if I have for example old bios and the latest drivers I will get a lot of system interruptions. Most of the APM tools will not give you a solution, these are only a few examples, so you need to ask first what do you like to do with an APM tool or do I need more and is there a solution for resolving problems quickly and react proactively. And yes I agree with Gartner but only if I like to monitor and need a sexy interface.
Radoslaw RuncI cannot speak about all range of ranked products because I don't know them well enough. I can speak about current Broadcom offering. It seems that this platform is strenthening since next to new recently issued new release of APM Broadcom introduced new release of Apps Synthetic Monitor. Also part of APM license is currently module App Experience Analytics for user experience monitoring. More than that APM,ASM and App Exp Analytics are part broader of AIOps family next to Uunified Infrastructure Management , NetOps - Spectrum and ML solution called Data Operation Inteligence (DOI).All these solutions are beeing glued with automation mechanisms coming from Broadcom One Automation platform.
Rob SalmonI think that a major player in this space -eG Innovations - is missing. I have personally used the product to manage our server farms/cloud platforms since 2004 and could not be more pleased. Functionality, cost, ease of use, ROI are all magic quadrant worthy and they are a leader in root cause analysis. The #1 call is why is it slow? eG gives you the answer usually in four clicks. Huge value and huge ROI in my humble opinion.
Rony_Sklar
IT Central Station

Please explain a a little about what AIOps is. How will it impact Application Performance Monitoring?